More unfairness for males

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Stirlingsays 09 Oct 17 4.40pm
Originally posted by Ray in Houston I had no doubt that you would agree this is a horrible decision. The point of me posting it was that one decision which, in your opinion, is proof of an anti-male agenda doesn't make it so. There's plenty of decisions the other way, like this nonsense in Detroit. Under Trump, the government is rolling back women's rights as fast as it can - it seems to be the one thing they have their s*** together to get done. Birth control within employer-based health insurance: gone. Access to abortion services: minimal and hobbled with medically unnecessary procedures, waiting time and medically unsound lectures. Ability to sue for wage discrimination: hobbled by executive order. It seems that they won't be happy until we're back to "barefoot and pregnant" being the norm for women. Edited by Ray in Houston (09 Oct 2017 4.34pm) Well, we probably agree on some or all of those matters if it indeed turns out to be the case. As for the anti male, anti masculinity cultural environment of today I don't believe it's even a question. We could go through the statistics if you like. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

09 Oct 17 4.40pm

Originally posted by Ray in Houston

I had no doubt that you would agree this is a horrible decision. The point of me posting it was that one decision which, in your opinion, is proof of an anti-male agenda doesn't make it so. There's plenty of decisions the other way, like this nonsense in Detroit.

Under Trump, the government is rolling back women's rights as fast as it can - it seems to be the one thing they have their s*** together to get done. Birth control within employer-based health insurance: gone. Access to abortion services: minimal and hobbled with medically unnecessary procedures, waiting time and medically unsound lectures. Ability to sue for wage discrimination: hobbled by executive order.

It seems that they won't be happy until we're back to "barefoot and pregnant" being the norm for women.

Edited by Ray in Houston (09 Oct 2017 4.34pm)

Well, we probably agree on some or all of those matters if it indeed turns out to be the case.

As for the anti male, anti masculinity cultural environment of today I don't believe it's even a question. We could go through the statistics if you like.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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PA Bedfordshire 09 Oct 17 7.35pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays I wholeheartedly disagree. It was the responsibility of this company to ensure that this situation didn't happen. Strange logic. So it’s their fault this woman committed a fraud against them? If someone steals from me, is it my fault I didn’t secure my property better?
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Bedfordshire 09 Oct 17 7.35pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I wholeheartedly disagree.

It was the responsibility of this company to ensure that this situation didn't happen.

Strange logic. So it’s their fault this woman committed a fraud against them? If someone steals from me, is it my fault I didn’t secure my property better?

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Stirlingsays 09 Oct 17 7.48pm
Originally posted by PA Strange logic. So it’s their fault this woman committed a fraud against them? If someone steals from me, is it my fault I didn’t secure my property better? Strawman situation construction. If you hold something important from me and my partner and I pay you and require you to release it only with both our consent and then you just give it to her without being in contact with me then you are negligent. You bare some responsibility. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

09 Oct 17 7.48pm

Originally posted by PA

Strange logic. So it’s their fault this woman committed a fraud against them? If someone steals from me, is it my fault I didn’t secure my property better?

Strawman situation construction.

If you hold something important from me and my partner and I pay you and require you to release it only with both our consent and then you just give it to her without being in contact with me then you are negligent.

You bare some responsibility.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Ray in Houston Houston 09 Oct 17 7.53pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays As for the anti male, anti masculinity cultural environment of today I don't believe it's even a question. We could go through the statistics if you like. You feeling that you're losing something by other people achieving equality, is the very definition of privilege. We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.
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Ray in Houston

Houston 09 Oct 17 7.53pm

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Originally posted by Stirlingsays

As for the anti male, anti masculinity cultural environment of today I don't believe it's even a question. We could go through the statistics if you like.

You feeling that you're losing something by other people achieving equality, is the very definition of privilege.

We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

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Stirlingsays 09 Oct 17 8.01pm
Originally posted by Ray in Houston You feeling that you're losing something by other people achieving equality, is the very definition of privilege. I don't believe in equality as a valid concept within societal terms. I believe in fairness and meritocracy. Privilege is a very poor word for what is essentially the class system with extras. It obviously does exist in different guises but I've seen the word abused so often that I'm very suspicious whenever it's brought up. Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Oct 2017 8.02pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

09 Oct 17 8.01pm

Originally posted by Ray in Houston

You feeling that you're losing something by other people achieving equality, is the very definition of privilege.

I don't believe in equality as a valid concept within societal terms. I believe in fairness and meritocracy.

Privilege is a very poor word for what is essentially the class system with extras. It obviously does exist in different guises but I've seen the word abused so often that I'm very suspicious whenever it's brought up.

Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Oct 2017 8.02pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Ray in Houston Houston 09 Oct 17 8.21pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays I don't believe in equality as a valid concept within societal terms. I believe in fairness and meritocracy. Privilege is a very poor word for what is essentially the class system with extras. It obviously does exist in different guises but I've seen the word abused so often that I'm very suspicious whenever it's brought up. You can't have a meritocracy without equality. We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.
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Ray in Houston

Houston 09 Oct 17 8.21pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I don't believe in equality as a valid concept within societal terms. I believe in fairness and meritocracy.

You can't have a meritocracy without equality.

We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

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Stirlingsays 09 Oct 17 8.27pm
Originally posted by Ray in Houston You can't have a meritocracy without equality. Yes you can, equality is a myth. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

09 Oct 17 8.27pm

Originally posted by Ray in Houston

You can't have a meritocracy without equality.

Yes you can, equality is a myth.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 09 Oct 17 8.28pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays I don't believe in equality as a valid concept within societal terms. I believe in fairness and meritocracy. Privilege is a very poor word for what is essentially the class system with extras. It obviously does exist in different guises but I've seen the word abused so often that I'm very suspicious whenever it's brought up. Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Oct 2017 8.02pm) What about meritocracy for non white people? You've said the English should come first. Then you say you believe in meritocracy. Hmm. Edited by nickgusset (09 Oct 2017 8.28pm)
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 09 Oct 17 8.28pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I don't believe in equality as a valid concept within societal terms. I believe in fairness and meritocracy.

Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Oct 2017 8.02pm)

What about meritocracy for non white people?
You've said the English should come first. Then you say you believe in meritocracy.

Hmm.

Edited by nickgusset (09 Oct 2017 8.28pm)

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Ray in Houston Houston 09 Oct 17 8.47pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Yes you can, equality is a myth. Equality is an aspiration. Saying it's a myth - as you have done repeatedly - makes absolutely no sense. You're saying that equality is like the lost city of Atlantis. Equality is a status, not a thing, and it can be achieved - or not - as we determine. We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.
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Ray in Houston

Houston 09 Oct 17 8.47pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Yes you can, equality is a myth.

Equality is an aspiration.

Saying it's a myth - as you have done repeatedly - makes absolutely no sense. You're saying that equality is like the lost city of Atlantis. Equality is a status, not a thing, and it can be achieved - or not - as we determine.

We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

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Ray in Houston Houston 09 Oct 17 8.52pm
Originally posted by nickgusset What about meritocracy for non white people? You've said the English should come first. Then you say you believe in meritocracy. Hmm. Meritocracy, as defined by the privileged, usually means that other people are welcome to earn what they can get as long as it doesn't come at the expense of what the privileged already have. And by "privileged", I don't mean "wealthy" - although they are almost certainly included - but those who have been privileged with a better geographical location, better education, better health through access to better nutrition and care, white skin and a Y chromosome. Edited by Ray in Houston (09 Oct 2017 8.56pm) We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.
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Ray in Houston

Houston 09 Oct 17 8.52pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

What about meritocracy for non white people?
You've said the English should come first. Then you say you believe in meritocracy.

Hmm.

Meritocracy, as defined by the privileged, usually means that other people are welcome to earn what they can get as long as it doesn't come at the expense of what the privileged already have.

And by "privileged", I don't mean "wealthy" - although they are almost certainly included - but those who have been privileged with a better geographical location, better education, better health through access to better nutrition and care, white skin and a Y chromosome.

Edited by Ray in Houston (09 Oct 2017 8.56pm)

We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

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Stirlingsays 09 Oct 17 9.10pm
Originally posted by Ray in Houston Equality is an aspiration. Saying it's a myth - as you have done repeatedly - makes absolutely no sense. You're saying that equality is like the lost city of Atlantis. Equality is a status, not a thing, and it can be achieved - or not - as we determine. Equality can be forced upon people, well some people, that much is true.....but it has little to do with fairness nor meritocracy in my view. I believe some of those who seek equality may be seeking it for noble reasons but that's about all that can be said in favour of it. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

09 Oct 17 9.10pm

Originally posted by Ray in Houston

Equality is an aspiration.

Equality can be forced upon people, well some people, that much is true.....but it has little to do with fairness nor meritocracy in my view.

I believe some of those who seek equality may be seeking it for noble reasons but that's about all that can be said in favour of it.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Ray in Houston Houston 09 Oct 17 9.17pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Equality can be forced upon people, well some people, that much is true.....but it has little to do with fairness nor meritocracy in my view. I believe some of those who seek equality may be seeking it for noble reasons but that's about all that can be said in favour of it. I think you have a twisted understanding of what equality means. Equality literally means judging people fairly and on their merits; not on whose v*** they emerged from. We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just waing with a football.
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Ray in Houston

Houston 09 Oct 17 9.17pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Equality can be forced upon people, well some people, that much is true.....but it has little to do with fairness nor meritocracy in my view.

I believe some of those who seek equality may be seeking it for noble reasons but that's about all that can be said in favour of it.

I think you have a twisted understanding of what equality means. Equality literally means judging people fairly and on their merits; not on whose v***** they emerged from.

We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football.

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