You are here: Home > Message Board > News & Politics > Topic
April 29 2024 9.34pm

Coronavirus (LOCKED)

Previous Topic | Next Topic


Page 852 of 1255 < 848 849 850 851 852 853 854 855 856 >

Topic Locked

View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 24 Feb 21 8.05pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by DanH

The bonds issued have a fixed rate over a fixed term. Even when the base rates go up the bonds issued now will not. Government borrowing is more problematic when the interest rates are higher.

Did you not learn anything after the last labour government? We added to the borrowing because we were constantly in a budget deficit and that’s pretty difficult to get out of when there’s always things to improve. Do you seriously believe this borrowing is going to be paid off within the lifespan of 10 year U.K. gilts? You know as much about this as Diane Abbott.

Edited by Rudi Hedman (24 Feb 2021 8.13pm)

 


COYP

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View DanH's Profile DanH Flag SW2 24 Feb 21 9.09pm Send a Private Message to DanH Add DanH as a friend

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

Did you not learn anything after the last labour government? We added to the borrowing because we were constantly in a budget deficit and that’s pretty difficult to get out of when there’s always things to improve. Do you seriously believe this borrowing is going to be paid off within the lifespan of 10 year U.K. gilts? You know as much about this as Diane Abbott.

Edited by Rudi Hedman (24 Feb 2021 8.13pm)

Do some more reading around how governments fund spending and various levers available to them. It’s an area quite far removed from how most people think of spending as their only reference point is their own household spending and budgeting. This is really quite different.

I am no fan of this government and their handling of the pandemic but what they are doing with borrowing is just sensible given the situation we are in.

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View DanH's Profile DanH Flag SW2 24 Feb 21 9.15pm Send a Private Message to DanH Add DanH as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays


So what the debt mountain is only heading one way extremely fast. The higher it gets the less realistic repayment gets and the more wary bond buyers will get.

As soon as confidence falls the whole deck of cards comes down and future bonds become unrealistically expensive.

You can't continually borrow against the future without paying a consequence.

And governments won't be able to cover the giant holes using bonds.

It's a Ponzi scheme.

Edited by Stirlingsays (24 Feb 2021 5.09pm)

You’re thinking of it far too simplistically and like a spending addict racking up credit card debt and taking out further credit cards to repay that debt. It really doesn’t work like that. Do some research and reading around some of the bonds still outstanding from back in the 1800s and the wars in the 1900s. It is sustainable a debt and there is always a market to issue more because it is a very safe investment for investors.

If you’re worried about this COVID borrowing ‘stealing from our futures’ you’ll be fuming when you’ll find out what we’ve been paying for over your lifetime from before you were born.

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View DanH's Profile DanH Flag SW2 24 Feb 21 9.35pm Send a Private Message to DanH Add DanH as a friend

Just a quick google search but this guy seems to have produced a nice little summary of the options available for governments to raise money. The section on borrowing below - should be a fairly digestible read.

[Link]

 

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 24 Feb 21 10.08pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by DanH

Just a quick google search but this guy seems to have produced a nice little summary of the options available for governments to raise money. The section on borrowing below - should be a fairly digestible read.

[Link]

I will have a sniff tomorrow.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 25 Feb 21 12.23am Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by DanH

Just a quick google search but this guy seems to have produced a nice little summary of the options available for governments to raise money. The section on borrowing below - should be a fairly digestible read.

[Link]

This guy is using an example of the general public buying long term government bonds, like Keir Starmer was advocating. How much do we need to raise? £500 billion, or is it a £trillion? Going to need a lot of Bob’s and Ken’s to invest money they aren’t going to see again until they’re dead or in a residential home. Not saying it’s not going to happen. I just don’t see it being the miracle cure. I expect we’ll sell ourselves out to China a bit more. They can do no wrong after all. Instead of selling the family silver in the way have been doing we’ll sell our future citizens’ housekeeping and disposable income to the very country responsible for this in the first place.

The U.K. current account deficit is 3.8 or 4% and not 2% like this man is using in his nice example. When will we ever have economic growth (that reduces the debt) higher than 3.8%, that lasts longer than a quarter or two?

I’ve always seen the upside to some devaluation rather than black Wednesday forced devaluation (and interest rates hiked above people’s eyes to prop up the £pound). Problem is every country is in a similar stage in their economic life cycle so what do you do? Out devalue each other? I expect the world economy bodies might have something to say about this kind of thing.

(Funny how all you remainers went potty about devaluation when it was caused by something you didn’t agree with but could actually benefit the people the left should be looking after. Blue collar workers. You know, the labour force the Labour Party were originally looking out for and not the sneering Emily Thornberry force).

Printing money is of course an option, but is only going to go okay if inflation and interest rates remain low like the last decade. For how long would that need to remain the case again?

I get the impression there’s a lot of people out there who think because money is now numbers on computer screens with no tangible worth or creation that it can be created whenever it’s needed and it’ll never ever matter. Nobody understands it so don’t be bothered about it. It’ll start to dawn on people again when there’s no furlough and GDP isn’t anywhere near high enough (how much will that account deficit be? Higher than 3.8%?)

 


COYP

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 25 Feb 21 12.30pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

[Link]

‘Not a single case of flu detected by Public Health England this year as Covid restrictions suppress virus

Experts say decline in infections could justify continued use of hand sanitiser and masks following coronavirus pandemic’

Jesus Christ we’re still going to be played with nonsense for a long time yet, and the bigger problem is many welcome it or accept it without question. If we continue with masks to save very old people from dying a bit earlier from flu then we’ll be in a worse place than returning back to normal autumn and winters in England. Scotland can do what they like.

 


COYP

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View ASCPFC's Profile ASCPFC Flag Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 25 Feb 21 2.03pm Send a Private Message to ASCPFC Add ASCPFC as a friend

[Link]

My favourite part is 'far right'

 


Red and Blue Army!

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 26 Feb 21 8.33am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by ASCPFC

[Link]

My favourite part is 'far right'

I remember the 'Mirror' I think it was describing someone as a 'free speech extremist'.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 26 Feb 21 8.41am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by DanH

Just a quick google search but this guy seems to have produced a nice little summary of the options available for governments to raise money. The section on borrowing below - should be a fairly digestible read.

[Link]

This is missing the woods for the trees on a massive scale.

These methods are viable within the context of normal deficits and are hardly anything new.

This guy you link to seems a bit one track. He suggests that leaving the ERM was better for the UK economy.....sure it was longer term, but he ignores the massive short term cost of it.

He also suggests Argentina defaulting was also better for their economy when it has resulted in massive interest on loans and defaulting carries with it several negatives even if you ignore the ethics of it.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View Rudi Hedman's Profile Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 26 Feb 21 9.01am Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

This is missing the woods for the trees on a massive scale.

These methods are viable within the context of normal deficits and are hardly anything new.

This guy you link to seems a bit one track. He suggests that leaving the ERM was better for the UK economy.....sure it was longer term, but he ignores the massive short term cost of it.

He also suggests Argentina defaulting was also better for their economy when it has resulted in massive interest on loans and defaulting carries with it several negatives even if you ignore the ethics of it.

His examples nicely fit his points, but in reality they aren’t true, right now. Economic growth more than 3.8%? Maybe for a short period like 2 to 4 quarters at an absolute push, but this debt is for a lifetime unfortunately for those paying for it.

 


COYP

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post
View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 26 Feb 21 9.11am Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

This is missing the woods for the trees on a massive scale.

These methods are viable within the context of normal deficits and are hardly anything new.

This guy you link to seems a bit one track. He suggests that leaving the ERM was better for the UK economy.....sure it was longer term, but he ignores the massive short term cost of it.

He also suggests Argentina defaulting was also better for their economy when it has resulted in massive interest on loans and defaulting carries with it several negatives even if you ignore the ethics of it.

Argentina has defaulted several times it makes foreign investment much harder and raising money more difficult, why would you loan money to a country that doesn't pay it back.

Something for the SNP to mull about if they ever get independence and decide not to take their fair share of the UK national debt.

 


One more point

Alert Alert a moderator to this post Edit this post

Topic Locked

Page 852 of 1255 < 848 849 850 851 852 853 854 855 856 >

Previous Topic | Next Topic

You are here: Home > Message Board > News & Politics > Topic