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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 21 Sep 21 3.48pm Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

To be clear, I believe social media companies should and could do a lot more to help - my point was that footballers shouldn't have to harm their own pockets for people to believe they're serious.

I don't disagree, I was just making a more general point really. Yes, I don't think it's reasonable to expect them to flee from platforms that are so embedded into society that it's akin to telling someone not to walk down the street if someone outside calls them the n word. At the same time, it is a balancing act because if we're going to give a reaction to every idiot hurling out slurs then it doesn't make for a very settled life. That's why the platforms should snuff out user and stuff that crosses the line legally.

 

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jeeagles Flag 21 Sep 21 3.51pm

Originally posted by rikz

How is it not true ?

Wealth is a bigger factor.

If you've got rich parents you can attend higher achieving schools, where you'll likely get more support and be surrounded by higher achieving pupils who lift each other up.

You'd be able to get into better universities, and get by without the need of part time jobs.

Parental subsidies will be able to assist in allowing wealthier graduates to get on intern schemes rather than graduate schemes, where due to the lack of wage, you'll be exposed to a greater level of experience rather than doing grunt work.

That will then put you in a much better position to get the top jobs.

On top of that, if your parents/social group have better jobs, they'll be able to pass on experience as to how best to navigate difficult situations and office politics.

No matter what your ethnicity, you'll be starting at an advantage if your parents are wealthy and successful.

Despite saying all this, I think that a parents primary goal is to work hard to provide a future for their children. If they want to put the investment in they should be able to. Otherwise you just start a race to the bottom. That's not to say society should do more to help people level up.

 

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View BlueJay's Profile BlueJay Flag UK 21 Sep 21 3.57pm Send a Private Message to BlueJay Add BlueJay as a friend

Originally posted by rikz


92% of the population is white, its just basic maths isn't it.

"from 2001 to 2011, the percentage of the population of England and Wales that was White British decreased from 87.4% to 80.5%"

I would be interested to know what it is in 2021

Over 50% of FTSE 100 boards have no ethnic representation on their boards. Maths init.


Edited by BlueJay (21 Sep 2021 4.02pm)

 

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View rikz's Profile rikz Flag Croydon 21 Sep 21 3.59pm Send a Private Message to rikz Add rikz as a friend

Originally posted by jeeagles

Wealth is a bigger factor.

If you've got rich parents you can attend higher achieving schools, where you'll likely get more support and be surrounded by higher achieving pupils who lift each other up.

You'd be able to get into better universities, and get by without the need of part time jobs.

Parental subsidies will be able to assist in allowing wealthier graduates to get on intern schemes rather than graduate schemes, where due to the lack of wage, you'll be exposed to a greater level of experience rather than doing grunt work.

That will then put you in a much better position to get the top jobs.

On top of that, if your parents/social group have better jobs, they'll be able to pass on experience as to how best to navigate difficult situations and office politics.

No matter what your ethnicity, you'll be starting at an advantage if your parents are wealthy and successful.

Despite saying all this, I think that a parents primary goal is to work hard to provide a future for their children. If they want to put the investment in they should be able to. Otherwise you just start a race to the bottom. That's not to say society should do more to help people level up.

People are born with massive advantages but in this country it still doesn't stop anyone else achieving what they want. Let's face it most people don't achieve what they want because they're neither intelligent or talented enough and unless you was blessed with good looks then you will more than likely live an average life.

 

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View Badger11's Profile Badger11 Flag Beckenham 21 Sep 21 4.00pm Send a Private Message to Badger11 Add Badger11 as a friend

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow


I just fundamentally disagree.

If the bar is Dr King, I think you can basically dismiss every cause in modern history.

You can believe in a cause without being MLK.

Okay but the players started this and have achieved very little if they want change they have to up the anti.

I made several suggestions but they are just that it's for the players to do something and if it is constructive such as boycotts I have no doubt the public will support them.

Taking the knee has become a formality like players shaking hands before the game and then spending 90 minutes winding each other up.

 


One more point

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jeeagles Flag 21 Sep 21 4.08pm

Originally posted by rikz
Yeah let's take a look at CEOs, the majority will tend to be white straight males. 92% of the population is white, its just basic maths isn't it. Let's see who are CEOs in China, India, Thailand, Ghana, Turkey etc o yeah diversity only matters in western countries doesn't it.

Just because other countries aren't as diverse as us doesn't mean we shouldn't be.

I don't believe in quotas for quotas sake. It should be achieved on merit. One of the problems Britain seemed to have going into the 70's were that all the top jobs were reserved for an old school tie clique who didn't necessarily have the skills to be in their positions. If we'd kept a more global outlook then maybe we would have had quite the decline that we did.

If you look at the Premier League we have created the best league in the world by taking the best talent from all around the world.

Also, if people want to promote a strong sense of community values that keep people on the straight and narrow, then it is important to include people. On the Fever Pitch - Rise of the Premier League show Les Ferdinand talks about how he couldn't go to football matches as a kid due to racism. These stories get passed on from parent to child and create an idea that people aren't part of their community based on their race, religion, or origin. This isn't limited to race or religion, I've seen people from Ireland, Scotland, Wales, the north of England, working class backgrounds (who are all white) all make statements about how they are excluded from society. Gestures and action are required to break that preconception. Strong parenting is required, but they can't do this alone, especially if that parent has experience historic discrimination.

As a online community, we aren't helping the situation when claims like "they are diluting the gene pool" aren't helping the situation. All it does is assist in pushing people further to the fringes.

 

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View rikz's Profile rikz Flag Croydon 21 Sep 21 5.11pm Send a Private Message to rikz Add rikz as a friend

Originally posted by jeeagles

Just because other countries aren't as diverse as us doesn't mean we shouldn't be.

I don't believe in quotas for quotas sake. It should be achieved on merit. One of the problems Britain seemed to have going into the 70's were that all the top jobs were reserved for an old school tie clique who didn't necessarily have the skills to be in their positions. If we'd kept a more global outlook then maybe we would have had quite the decline that we did.

If you look at the Premier League we have created the best league in the world by taking the best talent from all around the world.

Also, if people want to promote a strong sense of community values that keep people on the straight and narrow, then it is important to include people. On the Fever Pitch - Rise of the Premier League show Les Ferdinand talks about how he couldn't go to football matches as a kid due to racism. These stories get passed on from parent to child and create an idea that people aren't part of their community based on their race, religion, or origin. This isn't limited to race or religion, I've seen people from Ireland, Scotland, Wales, the north of England, working class backgrounds (who are all white) all make statements about how they are excluded from society. Gestures and action are required to break that preconception. Strong parenting is required, but they can't do this alone, especially if that parent has experience historic discrimination.

As a online community, we aren't helping the situation when claims like "they are diluting the gene pool" aren't helping the situation. All it does is assist in pushing people further to the fringes.

So why are we so diverse compared to other nations ? Why do so many migrants flee to western Europe, North America, Australia, New Zealand ? Maybe its not quite as bad for etthnice minorities in predominantly white Christian countries.

 

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jeeagles Flag 21 Sep 21 5.33pm

Originally posted by rikz

So why are we so diverse compared to other nations ? Why do so many migrants flee to western Europe, North America, Australia, New Zealand ? Maybe its not quite as bad for etthnice minorities in predominantly white Christian countries.

As a nation we have excellent values, both historically and in the present day. Some people want to slander our past, but in reality we've always been ahead of most of the the world in terms of equal opportunities, tolerance, and equality.

Christianity does have some real positive welcoming values too. When people mention that we are a white christian country, they are often saying it when they are talking about excluding people from our country because they don't think people from different backgrounds can fit in. That view is country to Christian beliefs, said by people who aren't Christian.

Fact is, that if you are a successful, progressive society, then people will want to come to your country. If you want people to stop wanting to come here, the only real way is to become a regressive state. This isn't to say we shouldn't have controls on allowing people to enter the country - although those entry conditions should be down to ability, and not race or religion.

On top of that, you've pretty much listed all of the developed world as places people go to.... where else would you expect them to go?

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Online Flag 21 Sep 21 5.42pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by kuge

Are you claiming that racism is no longer a problem in football and more generally in the UK?

The keeling is a reaction to abuse that these players have received and continue to receive. The fact that they get abused for taking the knee demonstrates that it is needed.

Circular logic.

'If you oppose what I do it's because you're racist, therefore justifying what I do and think.'

'If you agree with what I do it's because you agree that this is a racist society.'

Abuse exists in all societies and always will in free ones. The labelling in this one is frequently dishonest.

Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Sep 2021 5.44pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View rikz's Profile rikz Flag Croydon 21 Sep 21 5.42pm Send a Private Message to rikz Add rikz as a friend

Originally posted by jeeagles

As a nation we have excellent values, both historically and in the present day. Some people want to slander our past, but in reality we've always been ahead of most of the the world in terms of equal opportunities, tolerance, and equality.

Christianity does have some real positive welcoming values too. When people mention that we are a white christian country, they are often saying it when they are talking about excluding people from our country because they don't think people from different backgrounds can fit in. That view is country to Christian beliefs, said by people who aren't Christian.

Fact is, that if you are a successful, progressive society, then people will want to come to your country. If you want people to stop wanting to come here, the only real way is to become a regressive state. This isn't to say we shouldn't have controls on allowing people to enter the country - although those entry conditions should be down to ability, and not race or religion.

On top of that, you've pretty much listed all of the developed world as places people go to.... where else would you expect them to go?

Exactly there's a reason why these places are more developed than the rest of the world. Maybe people moving to them should embrace the culture of the country they're moving to

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Online Flag 21 Sep 21 5.49pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Any rational or honest person would have the logic to realise that in a real racist society groups like BLM or indeed the whole 'racism' playbook wouldn't be allowed to have any influence or power. You only have to look at places in the world where these ideas haven't been allowed to take root.

In a racist society there would be no 'diversity' industry at all.

The whole bag is collection of liars, fools and half truthers making it for all its worth while the elites allow them.....when the money pipe is turned off the tune will change.

Edited by Stirlingsays (21 Sep 2021 5.52pm)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 21 Sep 21 6.24pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

"from 2001 to 2011, the percentage of the population of England and Wales that was White British decreased from 87.4% to 80.5%"

I would be interested to know what it is in 2021

Over 50% of FTSE 100 boards have no ethnic representation on their boards. Maths init.


Edited by BlueJay (21 Sep 2021 4.02pm)

So the White majority will be reduced to around 70% now.
So in the space of 70 years, one lifetime, it has reduced by around 28%.

But of course, talk of replacement is just a myth, right?

 

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