Went out for lunch today - had temperature taken at the entrance and given a rule card which contained the following (amongst the usual SD stuff)
Customers are asked not to shout or laugh loudly to avoid airborne contamination.
Customers are asked to be seated at all times possible and to keep children sat down at the table.
Only 1 person to use the toilet facility at one time - a team member will be monitoring and controlling this.

Anyone who is deemed to break the guidelines will be asked to leave and may result in permanent exclusion from the premises and reported to the police.

Meanwhile our hospitals stand empty awaiting the “second wave”

You are obviously of good intent....I suppose I just differ from you as to where the line is for state control of personal autonomy in regards to threat level.

If this were the black death or even close to it I would probably agree with you. None of the makeshift hospitals they created were required.....They miscalculated. I still think they were right to make them due to unknowns at the time but the point still needs to be made that they were wrong.

I'm not saying you have said this but I'll say this about the flu vaccine. I think many people regard 'vaccines' as silver bullets when they aren't. For example I remember reading that the flu vaccine is about 2/3 effective due to flu diversity and how weak the person is.

So while I also hope for a vaccine I know that this virus is with us and isn't going away....In time, survival rates will continue to improve and people will come to accept it.

Eventually people will realise that masks were apart of that collective hysteria that a segment of society are always willing to buy into.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Yep, I hear you.

There's an old Japanese saying, 'the stake that sticks out gets hammered down'.

There's always a self righteous Karen, curtain twitcher or bedwetter out there eager to shop you.

If you aren't wearing a mask they become Donald Sutherland in the last scene of 'invasion of the body snatchers'.

Edited by Stirlingsays (04 Sep 2020 11.10pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

I would’ve left like I do in any places demanding masks or I walk round an empty shop or stand on a sticker in an empty shop. I’ve told and walked out of a few, and they’re empty. I wonder if they’ve worked it out yet. I went past costa coffee and it’s packed, probably because they know custom means their shop and jobs don’t go down the toilet with a disposable mask left in the Pan.

COYP

It would be useful for the author to point of that based on antibody data around 5% of the population may have had covid-19. Therefore an article based on the premise that it's only killed x amount of the population is a very arbitrary way of looking at the situation, being that if a vaccine doesn't materalise around 90%+ of people will eventually be infected.

Realistically that's probably 150,000+ dead and an indeterminate number of long term health consequences. It can be said that efforts to reduce covid dead, sadly result in resources being cut off for others, such as cancer patients for instance. It's hard to argue with that, in what is an impossible balancing act. That in turn also has to be balanced against the potential long term impact of covid. A worrying number of athletes appear to be having covid related heart issues right now for instance.

Influenza-related cardiac issues with influenza falls at about 10%. The studies so far on show covid heart damage present in almost 80% of patients including those with only otherwise mild symptoms. Studies at 2 and 3 months points have so far showed no significant improvement, but who knows beyond that. Larger studies are clearly needed. This is why data is vital and why the pick a side politics approach to deciding how to 'feel' about a pandemic is useless. The maskless halfwit on a train mentality.

At the end of the day nobody has a scooby right now about aspects such as this because it's too early to know other than emerging indications. It's not all about the body count though. While I'm basically just getting on with life as normal because I don't think people or society are really built to shut down, it doesn't follow that we should fool ourselves into believing the oft uttered 'it's just the flu' because it very obviously isn't.

Edited by BlueJay (05 Sep 2020 1.57am)

Do you have any links to studies that confirm that 80% of those infected have heart damage?

Not sure I agree with you that it is an “impossible balancing act” with regard to care and denying this to those ill with other non CV19 issues - the hospitals are now virtually empty, the number of people being hospitalised with CV19 is tiny, the number dying whilst being infected is tiny yet we focus on case counts created by inaccurate testing?

Thanks.