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April 30 2024 2.14am

The Stabbing of MP sir David Amess

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BlueJay Flag UK 18 Oct 21 3.10pm

Originally posted by ASCPFC

The obvious solution is Squid Game. Just on a larger scale.

I think you might be on to something . I've only just started watching Squid Game. I really enjoyed (if that's the right word!) the first episode. Battle Royale-like.

 

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BlueJay Flag UK 18 Oct 21 3.16pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

What people should most be careful of are liars and fear mongers.

When it comes to deciding what is true, you can listen to claims but before accepting one side you should investigate both before deciding what is reasonable.

That can be done here.

Actually I think it's perfectly fine to decide that radical individuals like Choudary and extreme groups like National Action - both on record as supporting murder - the latter of politicians (and both spreading the kind of ideas that are a causal factor in their deaths) are what people should be most concerned about. We should cauterise roads leading to these outcomes.

Edited by BlueJay (18 Oct 2021 3.19pm)

 

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View Stirlingsays's Profile Stirlingsays Flag 18 Oct 21 3.25pm Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

Actually I think it's perfectly fine to decide that radical individuals like Choudary and extreme groups like National Action - both on record as supporting murder - the latter of politicians (and both spreading the kind of ideas that are a causal factor in their deaths) are what people should be most concerned about. We should cauterise roads leading to these outcomes.

Edited by BlueJay (18 Oct 2021 3.19pm)

You know perfectly well what I am referring to.

You make a huge number of claims and I've been looking into some of them and that link busts a few of them.

It's very important that when people make claims that it is fairly looked into.

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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View PalazioVecchio's Profile PalazioVecchio Flag south pole 18 Oct 21 3.37pm Send a Private Message to PalazioVecchio Add PalazioVecchio as a friend


The Stabber grew up in Croydon

 


Eze Peasy at Anfield....

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View georgenorman's Profile georgenorman Flag 18 Oct 21 3.39pm Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

Well yes of course that's the ideal, but as we have seen we cannot always rely on people to scrutinise and manage their own behaviour. Nobody becoming radicalised realises that is happening to them. I think deep down, as we're sensible individuals, we believe that on some level they must realise what has happened to their thinking.

The disturbing reality is that they don't.

Nevermind that the average Choudary supporter or National Action adherent justifies murder of politicians (which is disturbing enough) we also have to consider that at the very end point, a person like this is throwing away his entire life even if he doesn't care about the life he's taking. He is literally adamant that he's in the right and that his act of inhumanity is somehow justified.

As I said before, the Internet has a lot to answer for in this regard. It's crack for the emotionally damaged and those who are easily led by people they are essentially being manipulated by.

The buck has got to stop somewhere - is Choudary responsible for his own actions?

 

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BlueJay Flag UK 18 Oct 21 3.51pm

Originally posted by georgenorman

The buck has got to stop somewhere - is Choudary responsible for his own actions?

Yes, which is why thankfully he was previously imprisoned. Freedom of speech, when abused to the point that it is used to malignantly corrupt minds and encourage actual harm, has limits.

Unfortunately due to the nature of the Internet, his sermons and words live on anyway. That and unbelievably his public speaking ban has been lifted now [Link] . These people grooming loners, oddballs and the angry alike know how to walk a rightrope, and so are difficult for the security services to deal with.

It's made worse in scenarios where the police are seen as the enemy, as authorities may then lack information they would've otherwise been aware of.

Edited by BlueJay (18 Oct 2021 4.03pm)

 

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View georgenorman's Profile georgenorman Flag 18 Oct 21 4.00pm Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

Yes, which is why thankfully he was previously imprisoned. Freedom of speech, when abused to the point that it is used to malignantly corrupt minds and encourage actual harm, has limits.

Unfortunately due to the nature of the Internet, his sermons and words live on anyway. That and unbelievably his public speaking ban has been lifted now [Link] . These people grooming loners, oddballs and the angry alike know how to walk a rightrope, and so are difficult for the security services to deal with.

It's made worse in scenarios where the police are seen as the enemy, as authorities may then lack information they would've otherwise been aware of.

Edited by BlueJay (18 Oct 2021 3.59pm)

Are Choudary's immediate assistants repsonsible for their own actions?

 

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BlueJay Flag UK 18 Oct 21 4.06pm

Originally posted by georgenorman

Are Choudary's immediate assistants repsonsible for their own actions?

That would depend upon what their actions were. If you can key me into the point you're trying to make I will be happy to answer it.

Edited by BlueJay (18 Oct 2021 4.18pm)

 

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View steeleye20's Profile steeleye20 Flag Croydon 18 Oct 21 4.11pm Send a Private Message to steeleye20 Add steeleye20 as a friend

Regardless of the event, it's ridiculous to make Southend a city.

 

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View georgenorman's Profile georgenorman Flag 18 Oct 21 4.23pm Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by BlueJay

That would depend upon what their actions were. If you can key me into the point you're trying to make I will be happy to answer it.

Edited by BlueJay (18 Oct 2021 4.18pm)

The point is that you think Choudary is responsible for his own actions, but those below him in his terrorist hierachy are not. You say they have all been 'radicalised'. Was Choudary radicalised? Was whoever radicalised him responsible for their own actions?

 

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BlueJay Flag UK 18 Oct 21 4.52pm

Originally posted by georgenorman

The point is that you think Choudary is responsible for his own actions, but those below him in his terrorist hierachy are not. You say they have all been 'radicalised'. Was Choudary radicalised? Was whoever radicalised him responsible for their own actions?

That's not what I said. It's not either/or.

Nobody would argue against the fact that Choudary is a dangerous individual who has encouraged and approved of heinous behaviour, which multiple former members of groups he's led have followed through on.

Those who are radicalised or develop radical views through any avenue they either act on, or encourage others to are of course all ultimately responsible for their behaviour.


Choudary has over time set up various groups that are inevitably banned, then pop up again with a different name and a similar swirl of adherents, so there is an element of whack-a-mole to it, indicative of these groups whether far left, far right, or Islamic. It's typically the same main players that keep popping up and these fringe groups all to frequently lead to the same destinations, ranging from dysfunction to dangerous.

Edited by BlueJay (18 Oct 2021 5.16pm)

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 18 Oct 21 5.55pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

I posted like that precisely because YOUR post is so "full of denial and waffle" that it was necessary to demarcate the response so that it could be better understood.

We haven't "imported people" from anywhere! That kind of description of immigration is ridiculous. We have, mostly, responded to humanitarian needs, alongside seeking to deal with skill shortages.

Do you want to send all the Scots and Irish "back home" now?

As with a couple of others on here, you are not worth communicating with. You have nothing to offer except spin.

You know full well why sectarianism began in Ireland and Scotland, and it was a perfect example of what happens when you mix groups that have reasons to resent each other and have ideological differences.

Now I really don't want to waste any more time countering the endless spew of nonsense that you inflict on this site.

 

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