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May 1 2024 8.49am

Margaret Thatcher

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View Willo's Profile Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 10 Apr 13 10.52am Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Quote

Very intelligent response. Well done.

I thought so too. Thank You.

 

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View The Sash's Profile The Sash Flag Now residing in Epsom - How Posh 10 Apr 13 10.54am Send a Private Message to The Sash Add The Sash as a friend

Quote Y Ddraig Goch at 10 Apr 2013 10.46am

Quote Kermit8 at 10 Apr 2013 10.42am

Quote Y Ddraig Goch at 10 Apr 2013 10.39am

People on here criticise Cameron when he blames the last Labour government for the s*** storm we are in as they claim he has had plenty of time (less than three years) to sort it all out.

On the other hand, 23 years after Maggie left office it is still acceptable to blame her for all the ills of our society.


A lot of today's sh1t can br traced back to Thatcherism/Reaganomics and the aggressive free market capitalism they espoused.


The world was changing, it had changed we were being left behind. As I've said before she got stuff wrong, anyone who had to sort out what she did is bound to have I just can't understand the myopic entrenched view of the left. It was that inflexibility at the time that helped make things more confrontational than necessary.

Just read this and thought it fairly well balanced.

[Link]

Agree - it is

This just about sums up where Britain was when she came to power thouugh - what a sad idictment from Callahgan

Over the course of the 1970s, two Prime Ministers, Edward Heath and James Callaghan, had been broken by the trade unions, while a third, Harold Wilson, descended into paranoia. Foreign papers talked of Britain as the Sick Man of Europe. Callaghan himself told his Labour colleagues: "If I were a young man, I would emigrate."


 


As far as the rules go, it's a website not a democracy - Hambo 3/6/2014

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View Moose's Profile Moose Flag In the sewer pipe... 10 Apr 13 10.55am Send a Private Message to Moose Add Moose as a friend

Quote Willo at 10 Apr 2013 10.52am

Quote

Very intelligent response. Well done.

I thought so too. Thank You.


This is an excellent thread, and one of the best debates on HOL for many a moon. Please play nicely you two.

 


Goodness is what you do. Not who you pray to.

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View nickyf's Profile nickyf 10 Apr 13 10.55am Send a Private Message to nickyf Add nickyf as a friend

my gran always regreted not buying her council house in the 80s as she was terrified of debt,
shortley after people purchased there council homes interest rates shot through the roof which was convienient,
also divisions were created on council estate as the ones that bought there homes started to look down there noses at those who did not which my gran experienced
40 years ago the majority of council tennants were hard working decent people who kept the other bad eggs in line,


[Link]

 

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 10 Apr 13 10.57am

Can anyone explain why borrowing went up under Thatch despite the billions raked in from North Sea oil and the cash from selling off national assets?

 

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View codeg73's Profile codeg73 Flag Purley 10 Apr 13 11.02am Send a Private Message to codeg73 Add codeg73 as a friend

Quote Kermit8 at 08 Apr 2013 5.14pm

Quote We are goin up! at 08 Apr 2013 5.13pm

Quote Kermit8 at 08 Apr 2013 5.12pm

Quote nickgusset at 08 Apr 2013 5.04pm

Hopefully her legacy will die with her. We are still suffering from her menage a trois with Reagan and neo liberalism.


Exactly. Which is why the Lady provokes still 23 years after being evicted from No.10.

See that nasty unemployable anti-social chav drinking too many alcopops and holding a nasty pitbull?

It didn't exist in early 1979. But, by early 1989 the first crop were about to be released onto society.

And her three boyfriends aren't much better.


What a load of absolute rubbish!


I lived it. You didn't.


Haven't posted for a long while but Agree, what a load of b*llocks. Get your facts straight as Two Dogs and Hooch which were the first alchopops, which didn't appear in the UK until 1995 which was 5yrs after she left and only 2yrs before Tony & WW arrived at No 10. Alcho pops were cynically created to raise revenues for the drinks companies (and also taxes) to get youngsters hooked on alcohol to counter-act the vast increase in Ecstacy, LCD, & Speed use which saw a massive downturn in alchohol consumption. Much better in government eyes to have a nation of alcoholics than drug addicts as can earn money out of them.
Oh and by the way it was Very Left Leaning Labour Tony Crosland that started the closure of Grammar schools.
a self-appointed guardian of the socialist conscience, who hated selective education with an arrogance possible only in one whose parents could afford to send him to public school(typical double standards Labour pr*ck really then)

 

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View Y Ddraig Goch's Profile Y Ddraig Goch Flag In The Crowd 10 Apr 13 11.03am Send a Private Message to Y Ddraig Goch Add Y Ddraig Goch as a friend

Quote nickgusset at 10 Apr 2013 10.48am

She sold off our industry and spunked the money.


What industry? we were sodding well bankrupt (all but)!

Yes she privatised British Gas etc but that's hardly selling off our industry. British Steel was shagged with Labour only keeping Steel works open for political reasons.

You make me laugh, you moan about people believing the media but all you post is soundbites

 


the dignified don't even enter in the game

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View Kermit8's Profile Kermit8 Flag Hevon 10 Apr 13 11.05am Send a Private Message to Kermit8 Add Kermit8 as a friend

Quote Y Ddraig Goch at 10 Apr 2013 10.46am

Quote Kermit8 at 10 Apr 2013 10.42am

Quote Y Ddraig Goch at 10 Apr 2013 10.39am

People on here criticise Cameron when he blames the last Labour government for the s*** storm we are in as they claim he has had plenty of time (less than three years) to sort it all out.

On the other hand, 23 years after Maggie left office it is still acceptable to blame her for all the ills of our society.


A lot of today's sh1t can br traced back to Thatcherism/Reaganomics and the aggressive free market capitalism they espoused.


The world was changing, it had changed we were being left behind. As I've said before she got stuff wrong, anyone who had to sort out what she did is bound to have I just can't understand the myopic entrenched view of the left. It was that inflexibility at the time that helped make things more confrontational than necessary.

Just read this and thought it fairly well balanced.

[Link]


Yeah I read that too and thought the same thing.

Looking back to 1979 it wasn't the ideology of Thatcher that we needed but her strength and ability to get a job done. She was far too right wing and too intransigent to understand and try to look after the country as a whole and to let vast swathes rot after taking away their work and the knock on effects of that was plainly unjust. Those workers had families. And those communities had small businesses dependent on those workers being able to access them financially.

It is almost forgivable when understanding the manufacturing business complexities at the time but dig a little more towards those who were already doing alright Jack - and the extra wealth they were accumulating on the back of her policy of low tax and high unemployment - whilst many millions were living on a meagre few pounds a day after being forced onto the dole, then resentment is surely understandable.

And I'm not talking about the man in the street who did ok. I mean the upper middle and upper already monied classes who suddenly found someone planting even more sackfuls of cash in their already overflowing coffers.

How she slept those 4 hours at night I'll never know.

We needed someone a bit like Thatcher. But not actually her.

 


Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]


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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 10 Apr 13 11.14am

Quote Pinky at 10 Apr 2013 10.07am

Quote DanH at 10 Apr 2013 9.17am

Quote Pinky at 10 Apr 2013 8.49am

Les vues de la marque de M. Russell Brand dans le Guardian d'aujourd'hui valent lu :

[Link]

Edited by Pinky (10 Apr 2013 8.51am)


So very well written and a brilliant read. Very interesting account from one of "Thatcher's children". I think her time in power can be summised as 'economic gain for social loss'.

"Is that what made her so formidable, her ability to ignore the suffering of others? Given the nature of her legacy "survival of the fittest" – a phrase that Darwin himself only used twice in On the Origin of Species, compared to hundreds of references to altruism, love and cooperation, it isn't surprising that there are parties tonight in Liverpool, Glasgow and Brixton – from where are they to have learned compassion and forgiveness?"

Interesting that Russell B refers to Darwinism, as her philosophy can be traced back (remember Victorian Values?) to Herbert Spencer and other Social Darwinists who tried to hijack Darwin's genius for their own selfish political ends. Darwin was dismissive of their ham-fisted attempts to use his work to justify everything from Napoleon Bonaparte to the rogue shopkeeper with his thumb on the scales.
Also he was using "fittest" in the sense of "best suited" to a particular evolutionary role and applies to everything – from bacteria to plants to huge mammals. Nothing to do with bodybuilding with your Tory chums down the gym before heading back to the estate agency in your Hoxton fin and Burton's suit, hoping to cream off another commission. Sorry to disappoint.


Indeed

Social Darwinism is psuedo-scientific claptrap, its a terms devoid of real meaning. Society is not subject to patterns even similar to evolutionary development.

It also has a very sticky history with the right, and the rightous, as it was used to 'justify' racial laws, patriarcialism, eugenics, class determinism etc.

Its used by people who a) don't understand evolutionary theory b) don't understand social theory c) Never even thought about Foulcolt and social constructionism.


 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 10 Apr 13 11.17am

Quote Y Ddraig Goch at 10 Apr 2013 11.03am

Quote nickgusset at 10 Apr 2013 10.48am

She sold off our industry and spunked the money.


What industry? we were sodding well bankrupt (all but)!

Yes she privatised British Gas etc but that's hardly selling off our industry. British Steel was shagged with Labour only keeping Steel works open for political reasons.

You make me laugh, you moan about people believing the media but all you post is soundbites


Public debt in the 80's was below 50% of GDP, the EU set the maximum at 60% when Thatch signed the Maastricht treaty in 92, so by European terms we were well within acceptable limits. Hardly bankrupt. In fact, we embarked on building the welfare state when our debt was 247% of GDP after ww2, so that is a weak argument.

 

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View Kermit8's Profile Kermit8 Flag Hevon 10 Apr 13 11.21am Send a Private Message to Kermit8 Add Kermit8 as a friend

Quote codeg73 at 10 Apr 2013 11.02am

Quote Kermit8 at 08 Apr 2013 5.14pm

Quote We are goin up! at 08 Apr 2013 5.13pm

Quote Kermit8 at 08 Apr 2013 5.12pm

Quote nickgusset at 08 Apr 2013 5.04pm

Hopefully her legacy will die with her. We are still suffering from her menage a trois with Reagan and neo liberalism.


Exactly. Which is why the Lady provokes still 23 years after being evicted from No.10.

See that nasty unemployable anti-social chav drinking too many alcopops and holding a nasty pitbull?

It didn't exist in early 1979. But, by early 1989 the first crop were about to be released onto society.

And her three boyfriends aren't much better.


What a load of absolute rubbish!


I lived it. You didn't.


Haven't posted for a long while but Agree, what a load of b*llocks. Get your facts straight as Two Dogs and Hooch which were the first alchopops, which didn't appear in the UK until 1995 which was 5yrs after she left and only 2yrs before Tony & WW arrived at No 10. Alcho pops were cynically created to raise revenues for the drinks companies (and also taxes) to get youngsters hooked on alcohol to counter-act the vast increase in Ecstacy, LCD, & Speed use which saw a massive downturn in alchohol consumption. Much better in government eyes to have a nation of alcoholics than drug addicts as can earn money out of them.
Oh and by the way it was Very Left Leaning Labour Tony Crosland that started the closure of Grammar schools.
a self-appointed guardian of the socialist conscience, who hated selective education with an arrogance possible only in one whose parents could afford to send him to public school(typical double standards Labour pr*ck really then)


You need to read kingdowieonthewall's earlier posts as he knows a lot more about alcopop history than you seem to.

Relying on Wikipedia isn't always the best avenue to go down when debating a point.


 


Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]


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View Bin Liner's Profile Bin Liner Flag London , Southfields 10 Apr 13 11.35am Send a Private Message to Bin Liner Add Bin Liner as a friend

Quote codeg73 at 10 Apr 2013 11.02am

Quote Kermit8 at 08 Apr 2013 5.14pm

Quote We are goin up! at 08 Apr 2013 5.13pm

Quote Kermit8 at 08 Apr 2013 5.12pm

Quote nickgusset at 08 Apr 2013 5.04pm

Hopefully her legacy will die with her. We are still suffering from her menage a trois with Reagan and neo liberalism.


Exactly. Which is why the Lady provokes still 23 years after being evicted from No.10.

See that nasty unemployable anti-social chav drinking too many alcopops and holding a nasty pitbull?

It didn't exist in early 1979. But, by early 1989 the first crop were about to be released onto society.

And her three boyfriends aren't much better.


What a load of absolute rubbish!


I lived it. You didn't.


Haven't posted for a long while but Agree, what a load of b*llocks. Get your facts straight as Two Dogs and Hooch which were the first alchopops, which didn't appear in the UK until 1995 which was 5yrs after she left and only 2yrs before Tony & WW arrived at No 10. Alcho pops were cynically created to raise revenues for the drinks companies (and also taxes) to get youngsters hooked on alcohol to counter-act the vast increase in Ecstacy, LCD, & Speed use which saw a massive downturn in alchohol consumption. Much better in government eyes to have a nation of alcoholics than drug addicts as can earn money out of them.
Oh and by the way it was Very Left Leaning Labour Tony Crosland that started the closure of Grammar schools.
a self-appointed guardian of the socialist conscience, who hated selective education with an arrogance possible only in one whose parents could afford to send him to public school(typical double standards Labour pr*ck really then)


bollox I'm afraid, alcopops, were appearing well into the late 80's seeing as I lived in New Malden at the time which was home to the Cambridge and Dickerage Road Estates where there were probably more bag ladies , Ciderwomen and general degenerates in the space of a couple of square miles then most London boroughs the Off Licences of The Kingston Road were doing a booming trade selling these drinks back then.

Edited by Bin Liner (10 Apr 2013 11.36am)

 


Portillo's teeth removed to boost pound

Boy roasts himself in sacrifice to Chris Kelly

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