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Stirlingsays Online 23 Aug 21 9.40pm
I suppose it's a truism of human nature that most people want to take the easiest path available to them. Any responsibility that they can offload onto the state is fully embraced.....which in many (though not all) cases involves their health. At some point we became a 'cradle to grave' state.....I understand that to a point because so many live long lives now and it's so fiscally expensive just to exist now. Still, as a mindset a reliance and trust in the state to always have your best interests at heart is a naive one. Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Aug 2021 9.43pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays Online

23 Aug 21 9.40pm

I suppose it's a truism of human nature that most people want to take the easiest path available to them.

Any responsibility that they can offload onto the state is fully embraced.....which in many (though not all) cases involves their health.

At some point we became a 'cradle to grave' state.....I understand that to a point because so many live long lives now and it's so fiscally expensive just to exist now. Still, as a mindset a reliance and trust in the state to always have your best interests at heart is a naive one.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Aug 2021 9.43pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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BlueJay UK 23 Aug 21 10.13pm
Originally posted by grumpymort No one is putting out the real message that people should be trying to get healthy this can be done by each person through lifestyle/diet changes. Edited by grumpymort (23 Aug 2021 9.10pm) My comment directly above your message was: "Maybe a key lesson as an individual to take, from a health point of view, is to stay as fit and healthy as possible because you never quite know when a spanner is going to fly into the works, or what comes next."
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BlueJay

UK 23 Aug 21 10.13pm

Originally posted by grumpymort

No one is putting out the real message that people should be trying to get healthy this can be done by each person through lifestyle/diet changes.

Edited by grumpymort (23 Aug 2021 9.10pm)

My comment directly above your message was:

"Maybe a key lesson as an individual to take, from a health point of view, is to stay as fit and healthy as possible because you never quite know when a spanner is going to fly into the works, or what comes next."

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grumpymort US/Thailand/UK 23 Aug 21 11.49pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays I suppose it's a truism of human nature that most people want to take the easiest path available to them. Any responsibility that they can offload onto the state is fully embraced.....which in many (though not all) cases involves their health. At some point we became a 'cradle to grave' state.....I understand that to a point because so many live long lives now and it's so fiscally expensive just to exist now. Still, as a mindset a reliance and trust in the state to always have your best interests at heart is a naive one. Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Aug 2021 9.43pm) People may live longer but quality of life is poor. Human nature is not easiest path by nature we use intelligence to overcome but this is not required now because we are told and people just listen without questioning. The issues with health are people being fed so much misinformation from NHS and media (People listen to everything doctors say as if it's facts and even if you show them the truth they wont listen because they only will listen to authority figure) No point living to 100 if 50 years is spend adding more meds and suffering this is something the health care doesn't care about because it is funded by people that want this and look at a lot of their policies they are pushing this. Diabetes type 2/ pre diabetes is a big issue yet not really taken serious and you always hear about its obese people disease only newer any truth about it being diet issue need to stop eating the carbs (NHS encourage you to eat high carb foods and do not even pay attention to pre diabetes as if its not an issue) Finance wise people wouldn't be expensive if healthy also it balances out because if people are healthy the health service doesn't need all the staff it has also wont get a lot of funding from big pharma. (a lot of the money issues is poor management) (VPN) - [Link] (Alt VPN) - [Link]
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grumpymort

US/Thailand/UK 23 Aug 21 11.49pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I suppose it's a truism of human nature that most people want to take the easiest path available to them.

Any responsibility that they can offload onto the state is fully embraced.....which in many (though not all) cases involves their health.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Aug 2021 9.43pm)

People may live longer but quality of life is poor.

Human nature is not easiest path by nature we use intelligence to overcome but this is not required now because we are told and people just listen without questioning.

The issues with health are people being fed so much misinformation from NHS and media (People listen to everything doctors say as if it's facts and even if you show them the truth they wont listen because they only will listen to authority figure)

No point living to 100 if 50 years is spend adding more meds and suffering this is something the health care doesn't care about because it is funded by people that want this and look at a lot of their policies they are pushing this.

Diabetes type 2/ pre diabetes is a big issue yet not really taken serious and you always hear about its obese people disease only newer any truth about it being diet issue need to stop eating the carbs (NHS encourage you to eat high carb foods and do not even pay attention to pre diabetes as if its not an issue)

Finance wise people wouldn't be expensive if healthy also it balances out because if people are healthy the health service doesn't need all the staff it has also wont get a lot of funding from big pharma. (a lot of the money issues is poor management)

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BlueJay UK 25 Aug 21 1.13am
Covid infection protection waning in double jabbed - "The real-world study includes data on positive Covid PCR test results between May and July 2021 among more than a million people who had received two doses of Pfizer or AstraZeneca vaccine. Protection after two shots of Pfizer decreased from 88% at one month to 74% at five to six months. For AstraZeneca, the fall was from 77% to 67% at four to five months. " I wouldn't really say the decline is unexpected or all that bad really. It will be interesting to read the data on people who had covid 'after' being vaccinated to see how much of a boost they get. That may well wind up being a very common occurrence and logically should offer better protection than natural infection or vaccination alone.
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BlueJay

UK 25 Aug 21 1.13am

Covid infection protection waning in double jabbed -

"The real-world study includes data on positive Covid PCR test results between May and July 2021 among more than a million people who had received two doses of Pfizer or AstraZeneca vaccine.

Protection after two shots of Pfizer decreased from 88% at one month to 74% at five to six months.

For AstraZeneca, the fall was from 77% to 67% at four to five months. "

I wouldn't really say the decline is unexpected or all that bad really. It will be interesting to read the data on people who had covid 'after' being vaccinated to see how much of a boost they get. That may well wind up being a very common occurrence and logically should offer better protection than natural infection or vaccination alone.

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Stirlingsays Online 25 Aug 21 1.18am
Originally posted by grumpymort People may live longer but quality of life is poor. Human nature is not easiest path by nature we use intelligence to overcome but this is not required now because we are told and people just listen without questioning. The issues with health are people being fed so much misinformation from NHS and media (People listen to everything doctors say as if it's facts and even if you show them the truth they wont listen because they only will listen to authority figure) No point living to 100 if 50 years is spend adding more meds and suffering this is something the health care doesn't care about because it is funded by people that want this and look at a lot of their policies they are pushing this. Diabetes type 2/ pre diabetes is a big issue yet not really taken serious and you always hear about its obese people disease only newer any truth about it being diet issue need to stop eating the carbs (NHS encourage you to eat high carb foods and do not even pay attention to pre diabetes as if its not an issue) Finance wise people wouldn't be expensive if healthy also it balances out because if people are healthy the health service doesn't need all the staff it has also wont get a lot of funding from big pharma. (a lot of the money issues is poor management) Yep, there's a lot to agree with there. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays Online

25 Aug 21 1.18am

Originally posted by grumpymort

People may live longer but quality of life is poor.

Human nature is not easiest path by nature we use intelligence to overcome but this is not required now because we are told and people just listen without questioning.

Yep, there's a lot to agree with there.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Stirlingsays Online 25 Aug 21 1.21am
Originally posted by BlueJay Covid infection protection waning in double jabbed - "The real-world study includes data on positive Covid PCR test results between May and July 2021 among more than a million people who had received two doses of Pfizer or AstraZeneca vaccine. Protection after two shots of Pfizer decreased from 88% at one month to 74% at five to six months. For AstraZeneca, the fall was from 77% to 67% at four to five months. " I wouldn't really say the decline is unexpected or all that bad really. It will be interesting to read the data on people who had covid 'after' being vaccinated to see how much of a boost they get. That may well wind up being a very common occurrence and logically should offer better protection than natural infection or vaccination alone. It gets more like a treatment everyday. Just how long are they going to spend on free booster jabs for tens of millions of people? A couple of years perhaps? Then maybe it'll go back to only the over fifties (or immune suppressed)...as it's been for flu for many years. If that happens many of the more alarmist (and many of the lapdogs in the media) will have to wipe the egg off their faces.....mind you most will probably just forget or conveniently forget by then. Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Aug 2021 1.25am) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays Online

25 Aug 21 1.21am

Originally posted by BlueJay

Covid infection protection waning in double jabbed -

"The real-world study includes data on positive Covid PCR test results between May and July 2021 among more than a million people who had received two doses of Pfizer or AstraZeneca vaccine.

Protection after two shots of Pfizer decreased from 88% at one month to 74% at five to six months.

For AstraZeneca, the fall was from 77% to 67% at four to five months. "

It gets more like a treatment everyday.

Just how long are they going to spend on free booster jabs for tens of millions of people?

A couple of years perhaps?

Then maybe it'll go back to only the over fifties (or immune suppressed)...as it's been for flu for many years. If that happens many of the more alarmist (and many of the lapdogs in the media) will have to wipe the egg off their faces.....mind you most will probably just forget or conveniently forget by then.

Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Aug 2021 1.25am)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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BlueJay UK 25 Aug 21 2.48am
The most sensible cost and health balance would probably have been to give it to the over 60s or over 70s once a year. There would be, you'd think, so much natural protection, via combinations of vaccine and mild infection or bother that any twice yearly plan would be overkill (but will probably happen anyway). Understandably the elderly have failing immune systems, and the immune suppressed, cancer sufferers and the like would benefit.
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BlueJay

UK 25 Aug 21 2.48am

The most sensible cost and health balance would probably have been to give it to the over 60s or over 70s once a year. There would be, you'd think, so much natural protection, via combinations of vaccine and mild infection or bother that any twice yearly plan would be overkill (but will probably happen anyway). Understandably the elderly have failing immune systems, and the immune suppressed, cancer sufferers and the like would benefit.

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W12 26 Aug 21 11.56am
The government are now planning on "jabbing" children at no risk from this desease without parental consent and people are worried about f*ing Afganistan. [Link] “The NHS has drawn up plans to start vaccinating 12-year-olds from the first week schools go back, The Telegraph can reveal” and: "NHS guidance seen by the Planet Normal podcast (you can listen to it on the player below) and circulated to trusts states that most 12 to 15-year-olds should be deemed "Gillick competent to provide own consent" on jabs. That refers to a 1985 legal ruling which said a teenage girl could obtain contraception without her parents’ involvement" I'm with this man: [Link] Over my dead f*ing body.
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W12 26 Aug 21 11.56am

The government are now planning on "jabbing" children at no risk from this desease without parental consent and people are worried about f***ing Afganistan.

[Link]

“The NHS has drawn up plans to start vaccinating 12-year-olds from the first week schools go back, The Telegraph can reveal”

and:

"NHS guidance seen by the Planet Normal podcast (you can listen to it on the player below) and circulated to trusts states that most 12 to 15-year-olds should be deemed "Gillick competent to provide own consent" on jabs. That refers to a 1985 legal ruling which said a teenage girl could obtain contraception without her parents’ involvement"

I'm with this man:

[Link]

Over my dead f***ing body.

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W12 26 Aug 21 11.58am
UPDATED REPORT PUBLISHED 19TH AUG 2021 MHRA Yellow Card Reporting up to 11th Aug 2021 Reactions - 293,779 (Pfizer) + 813,622 (AZ) + 41,274 (Moderna) + 3093 (Unknown) = 1,151,768 Reports - 104,446 (Pfizer) + 228,239 (AZ) + 13,325 (Moderna) + 1022 (Unknown) = 347,032 Fatal - 501 (Pfizer) + 1053 (AZ) + 14 (Moderna) + 28 (Unknown) = 1596 Acute Cardiac - 4640 (Pfizer) + 9053 (AZ) + 463 (Moderna) + 33 (Unknown) = 14,189 Pericarditis/Myocarditis (Heart inflammation) - 339 (Pfizer) + 245 (AZ) + 61 (Moderna) + 2 (Unknown) = 647 Myocardial Infarction & Heart Failure - 225 (Pfizer) + 484 (AZ) + 11 (Moderna) + 6 (Unknown) = 726 Anaphylaxis - 461 (Pfizer) + 808 (AZ) + 30 (Moderna) + 1 (Unknown) = 1300 Blood Disorders - 9933 (Pfizer) + 7327 (AZ) + 785 (Moderna) + 44 (Unknown) = 18,089 Infections - 6920 (Pfizer) + 17,995 (AZ) + 682 (Moderna) + 88 (Unknown) = 25,685 Herpes - 1557 (Pfizer) + 2463 (AZ) + 69 (Moderna) + 13 (Unknown) = 4102 Headaches - 21,193 (Pfizer) + 83,366 (AZ) + 2370 (Moderna) + 227 (Unknown) = 107,156 Migraine - 2400 (Pfizer) + 7989 (AZ) + 264 (Moderna) + 29 (Unknown) = 10,682 Eye Disorders - 4872 (Pfizer) + 13,649 (AZ) + 453 (Moderna) + 52 (Unknown) = 19,026 Blindness - 96 (Pfizer) + 279 (AZ) + 11 (Moderna) + 3 (Unknown) = 389 Deafness - 181 (Pfizer) + 359 (AZ) + 13 (Moderna) + 2 (Unknown) = 555 Psychiatric Disorders - 5929 (Pfizer) + 16,930 (AZ) + 815 (Moderna) + 73 (Unknown) = 23,747 Skin Disorders - 20,741 (Pfizer) + 50,087 (AZ) + 6395 (Moderna) + 208 (Unknown) = 77,431 Swelling Face - 606 (Pfizer) + 1051 (AZ) + 60 (Moderna) + 10 (Unknown) = 1727 Spontaneous Abortions - 258 + 6 stillbirth/foetal death (Pfizer) + 185 + 2 stillbirth (AZ) + 21 + 1 foetal death (Moderna) + 1 (Unknown) = 465 + 9 (figures imply 16 related maternal deaths) Vomiting - 3151 (Pfizer) + 11,320 (AZ) + 447 (Moderna) + 39 (Unknown) = 14,957 Facial Paralysis incl. Bell’s Palsy - 675 (Pfizer) + 850 (AZ) + 46 (Moderna) + 5 (Unknown) = 1576 Nervous System Disorders - 51,628 (Pfizer) + 173,431 (AZ) + 6348 (Moderna) + 588 (Unknown) = 231,995 Strokes and CNS haemorrhages - 489 (Pfizer) + 1978 (AZ) + 14 (Moderna) + 8 (Unknown) = 2489 Guillian Barre Syndrome - 42 (Pfizer) + 383 (AZ) + 2 (Moderna) + 5 (Unknown) = 432 Tremor - 1247 (Pfizer) + 9659 (AZ) + 144 (Moderna) + 37 (Unknown) = 11,087 Pulmonary Embolism & Deep Vein Thrombosis - 573 (Pfizer) + 2666 (AZ) + 25 (Moderna) + 18 (Unknown) = 3282 Respiratory Disorders - 12,581 (Pfizer) + 27,299 (AZ) + 1066 (Moderna) + 109 (Unknown) = 41,055 Seizures - 686 (Pfizer) + 1857 (AZ) + 109 (Moderna) + 9 (Unknown) = 2661 Paralysis - 296 (Pfizer) + 730 (AZ) + 36 (Moderna) + 5 (Unknown) = 1067 Haemorrhage (All types) - 2483 (Pfizer) + 4672 (AZ) + 313 (Moderna) + 36 (Unknown) = 7504 Vertigo/Tinnitis - 2618 (Pfizer) + 6275 (AZ) + 259 (Moderna) + 25 (Unknown) = 9177 Renal & Urinary Disorders - 775 (Pfizer) + 2495 (AZ) + 85 (Moderna) + 23 (Unknown) = 3378 Reproductive/Breast - 16,336 (Pfizer) + 16,460 (AZ) + 2102 (Moderna) + 112 (Unknown) = 35,010
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W12 26 Aug 21 11.58am

UPDATED REPORT PUBLISHED 19TH AUG 2021
MHRA Yellow Card Reporting up to 11th Aug 2021

Reactions - 293,779 (Pfizer) + 813,622 (AZ) + 41,274 (Moderna) + 3093 (Unknown) = 1,151,768

Reports - 104,446 (Pfizer) + 228,239 (AZ) + 13,325 (Moderna) + 1022 (Unknown) = 347,032

Fatal - 501 (Pfizer) + 1053 (AZ) + 14 (Moderna) + 28 (Unknown) = 1596

Acute Cardiac - 4640 (Pfizer) + 9053 (AZ) + 463 (Moderna) + 33 (Unknown) = 14,189

Pericarditis/Myocarditis (Heart inflammation) - 339 (Pfizer) + 245 (AZ) + 61 (Moderna) + 2 (Unknown) = 647

Myocardial Infarction & Heart Failure - 225 (Pfizer) + 484 (AZ) + 11 (Moderna) + 6 (Unknown) = 726

Anaphylaxis - 461 (Pfizer) + 808 (AZ) + 30 (Moderna) + 1 (Unknown) = 1300

Blood Disorders - 9933 (Pfizer) + 7327 (AZ) + 785 (Moderna) + 44 (Unknown) = 18,089

Infections - 6920 (Pfizer) + 17,995 (AZ) + 682 (Moderna) + 88 (Unknown) = 25,685

Herpes - 1557 (Pfizer) + 2463 (AZ) + 69 (Moderna) + 13 (Unknown) = 4102

Headaches - 21,193 (Pfizer) + 83,366 (AZ) + 2370 (Moderna) + 227 (Unknown) = 107,156

Migraine - 2400 (Pfizer) + 7989 (AZ) + 264 (Moderna) + 29 (Unknown) = 10,682

Eye Disorders - 4872 (Pfizer) + 13,649 (AZ) + 453 (Moderna) + 52 (Unknown) = 19,026

Blindness - 96 (Pfizer) + 279 (AZ) + 11 (Moderna) + 3 (Unknown) = 389

Deafness - 181 (Pfizer) + 359 (AZ) + 13 (Moderna) + 2 (Unknown) = 555

Psychiatric Disorders - 5929 (Pfizer) + 16,930 (AZ) + 815 (Moderna) + 73 (Unknown) = 23,747

Skin Disorders - 20,741 (Pfizer) + 50,087 (AZ) + 6395 (Moderna) + 208 (Unknown) = 77,431

Swelling Face - 606 (Pfizer) + 1051 (AZ) + 60 (Moderna) + 10 (Unknown) = 1727

Spontaneous Abortions - 258 + 6 stillbirth/foetal death (Pfizer) + 185 + 2 stillbirth (AZ) + 21 + 1 foetal death (Moderna) + 1 (Unknown) = 465 + 9 (figures imply 16 related maternal deaths)

Vomiting - 3151 (Pfizer) + 11,320 (AZ) + 447 (Moderna) + 39 (Unknown) = 14,957

Facial Paralysis incl. Bell’s Palsy - 675 (Pfizer) + 850 (AZ) + 46 (Moderna) + 5 (Unknown) = 1576

Nervous System Disorders - 51,628 (Pfizer) + 173,431 (AZ) + 6348 (Moderna) + 588 (Unknown) = 231,995

Strokes and CNS haemorrhages - 489 (Pfizer) + 1978 (AZ) + 14 (Moderna) + 8 (Unknown) = 2489

Guillian Barre Syndrome - 42 (Pfizer) + 383 (AZ) + 2 (Moderna) + 5 (Unknown) = 432

Tremor - 1247 (Pfizer) + 9659 (AZ) + 144 (Moderna) + 37 (Unknown) = 11,087

Pulmonary Embolism & Deep Vein Thrombosis - 573 (Pfizer) + 2666 (AZ) + 25 (Moderna) + 18 (Unknown) = 3282

Respiratory Disorders - 12,581 (Pfizer) + 27,299 (AZ) + 1066 (Moderna) + 109 (Unknown) = 41,055

Seizures - 686 (Pfizer) + 1857 (AZ) + 109 (Moderna) + 9 (Unknown) = 2661

Paralysis - 296 (Pfizer) + 730 (AZ) + 36 (Moderna) + 5 (Unknown) = 1067

Haemorrhage (All types) - 2483 (Pfizer) + 4672 (AZ) + 313 (Moderna) + 36 (Unknown) = 7504

Vertigo/Tinnitis - 2618 (Pfizer) + 6275 (AZ) + 259 (Moderna) + 25 (Unknown) = 9177

Renal & Urinary Disorders - 775 (Pfizer) + 2495 (AZ) + 85 (Moderna) + 23 (Unknown) = 3378

Reproductive/Breast - 16,336 (Pfizer) + 16,460 (AZ) + 2102 (Moderna) + 112 (Unknown) = 35,010

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W12 26 Aug 21 12.00pm
[Link] "It is estimated that only 10% of serious reactions and between 2 and 4% of non-serious reactions are reported. Under-reporting coupled with a decline in reporting makes it especially important to report all suspicions of adverse drug reactions to the Yellow Card Scheme"
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W12 26 Aug 21 12.00pm

[Link]

"It is estimated that only 10% of serious reactions and between 2 and 4% of non-serious reactions are reported. Under-reporting coupled with a decline in reporting makes it especially important to report all suspicions of adverse drug reactions to the Yellow Card Scheme"

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W12 26 Aug 21 12.01pm
wise the f*** up!
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W12 26 Aug 21 12.01pm

wise the f*** up!

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grumpymort US/Thailand/UK 26 Aug 21 1.01pm
Originally posted by W12 [Link] "It is estimated that only 10% of serious reactions and between 2 and 4% of non-serious reactions are reported. Under-reporting coupled with a decline in reporting makes it especially important to report all suspicions of adverse drug reactions to the Yellow Card Scheme" No numbers that are used in an open environment can really be taken serious no control factors so anything could be doing this no prove of causation. This has shown the true picture of how unhealthy a lot of humans are. (this is what the focus should really be on) Too many variables this is again why you have to do proper controlled human studies for these things which they did not do. (VPN) - [Link] (Alt VPN) - [Link]
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grumpymort

US/Thailand/UK 26 Aug 21 1.01pm

Originally posted by W12

[Link]

No numbers that are used in an open environment can really be taken serious no control factors so anything could be doing this no prove of causation.

This has shown the true picture of how unhealthy a lot of humans are. (this is what the focus should really be on)

Too many variables this is again why you have to do proper controlled human studies for these things which they did not do.

(VPN) - [Link]
(Alt VPN) - [Link]

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